Category: Evening Chabura

Learn the משנה דף מה

Learn “תוספת “זוקפין

See רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כב & כג which says the order was opposite of Tosfos 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=288

Major Question:

The Rambam rules ערבה בנטילה so how could they Rambam say the Kohanim circled the Mizbeach with Lulavim in their hands?

Learn ערוך לנר on Tosfos

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=175

Learn תוספת “אני

Rashi gives two explanations to the words אני והו 

Questions:

According to Rashi’s first explanation, it is the gematria of אנא ה. Why are we saying words in code and not directly? 

According to the second explanation of Rashi the שם of והו should be first as it’s the first one encrypted in the pasuk and אני should be second?

Why did they circle the Mizbeach? Why on Hoshana Rabbah did they circle seven times? 

Learn מהרש”א

See פירוש המשניות לרמבם for a fourth explanation. 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=487

Questions:

What is the meaning of “מיד תינוקות שומטין את לולביהן ואוכלין אתרוגיהן

Rashi explains the adults would grab the Lulavim and Esrogim from the hands of the children.

Why is this not a violation of stealing?

Rashi says because this was done in the spirit of simcha.

How does the spirit of simcha absolve one from the violation of stealing?

Learn “תוספת “מיד 

Who applies this leniency to other scenarios in which damage occurs while engaged in activities in the spirit of simcha.  and offers an alternate explanation in the Mishna. 

See שולחן ערוך אורח חיים ס’ תרצ”ה רמ”א סוף סעיף ב “וי”א דאם הזיק and משנה ברורה ס”ק יג & יד

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=326

See שולחן ערוך אורח חיים ס’ תרצ”ו רמ”א סעיף ח  and משנה ברורה ס”ק ל – לב

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=330

Does this exemption apply also to human injury besides momentary damage? 

See מרדכי פרק שני ס’ תשמב- ג (in back of the Gemara)

See תרומת הדשן ס’ ר”י מזיק חבירו בשעת הקפות

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=1835&st=&pgnum=192&hilite=

See מ”א תרצה ס”ק ז “דווקא ממון

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14327&st=&pgnum=440

And לבושי שרד & מחצית השקל 

Why is person exempt from damaging in course of simcha when there is a rule  אדם מועד לעולם – person is always responsible for damage?

Learn פמ”ג ס”ק ז מוחלין  & ס”ק ח פורים אונס קצת

Learn חו”מ שע”ח מבואר פטור גם מזיק גוף אדם

And see דרכי משה & ב”ח for a different reason 

Learn the “גמרא דף מד: “אמר אייבו (eight lines from bottom of the Amud) until the two dots. 

Questions:

What is the difference between the לישנא קמא and the לישנא בתרא? 

Rashi explains the issue of concern for the halacha of traveling on Friday is the lack of food at one’s point of destination. Why does it matter the amount of distance one needs to travel even if one traveled less of a distance but arrived home close to Shabbos there would still be the same issue?  

Does the same amount of limited distance apply if one is traveling by car or plane? 

Learn רמב״ם הלכות שבת פרק ל הלכה יא

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=133

Learn the ערוך לנר 

Learn שולחן ערוך או”ח ס’ רמ”ט סעיף א with the משנה ברורה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60388&st=&pgnum=32&hilite=

Continue learning the Gemara until the Mishna דף מה

Learn the “גמרא דף מד: “אמר אייבו (middle of the Amud) until the next “אמר אייבו” (eight lines from bottom of the Amud) 

Question:

What was so upright and special about the person that ר’ אלעזר בר צדוק gave him such praise?

Continue learning the Gemara until the two dots. 

Questions:

What is the difference between the לישנא קמא and the לישנא בתרא? 

Rashi explains the issue of concern for the halacha of traveling on Friday is the lack of food at one’s point of destination. Why does it matter the amount of distance one needs to travel even if one traveled less of a distance but arrived home close to Shabbos there would still be the same issue?  

Does the same amount of limited distance apply if one is traveling by car or plane? 

Learn שולחן ערוך או”ח ס’ רמ”ט סעיף א with the משנה ברורה

Learn רמב״ם הלכות שבת פרק ל הלכה יא

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=133

Learn שולחן ערוך או”ח ס’ רמ”ט סעיף א with the משנה ברורה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60388&st=&pgnum=32&hilite=

Continue learning the Gemara until the Mishna דף מה

Quickly review the “גמרא דף מד: “אמר אייבו until next “אמר אייבו

Questions:
In conclusion of the Gemara is the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah זכר למקדש or מנהג נביאים?
What do we conclude lhalacha in regards to making a bracha on taking the Aravos?
Learn טור אורח חיים ס’ תרס”ד סעיף ב for a few different opinions
https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595
And שולחן ערוך סע’ ב, ד-ו with the משנה ברורה for final conclusion
https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=271

Major Question:
The גמרא דף מג concluded that Aravah was בנטילה – everyone waved the Aravos each day of Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash and the זכר למקדש replicates the way it was performed in the Beis Hamikdash & on דף מד the aravos were taken when encircling the Mizbaich.

The gemara concluded that Hoshanos we’re instituted זכר למקדש for the נטילה which was walking around the mizbaich?
Why is our minhag to walk around the bima each day of Sukkos with the set of Daled Minim one time and on Hoshana Rabbah seven times. We should be holding aravos as they did in the Beis Hamikdash when they circled the Mizbaich?
See בית יוסף & ב”ח סעיף ג
https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

Learn the “גמרא דף מד: “אמר אייבו until next “אמר אייבו

Questions:

What needs to be done with the aravos in order to fulfill the mitzvah of Hoshanas?

See רש”י דף מג: “והביאום (three lines from bottom of the Amud) 

And רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כב

In conclusion of the Gemara is the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah זכר למקדש or מנהג נביאים? 

What do we conclude lhalacha in regards to making a bracha on taking the Aravos? 

Learn טור אורח חיים ס’ תרס”ד סעיף ב for a few different opinions

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

And שולחן ערוך סע’ ב, ד-וwith the משנה ברורה for final conclusion

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=271

Major Question:

The גמרא דף מג concluded that Aravah was בנטילה – everyone waved the Aravos each day of Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash and the זכר למקדש replicates the way it was performed in the Beis Hamikdash & on דף מד the aravos were taken when encircling the Mizbaich.

Why is our minhag to walk around the bima each day of Sukkos one time only with the set of Daled Minim and on Hoshana Rabbah seven times.  We should be holding aravos when circling the bima as they did in the Beis Hamikdash when circling the Mizbaich? 

But this seems incongruent with how  the Beis Hamikdash as on the practice  Especially since we conclude that Hoshanos we’re instituted זכר למקדש for the נטילה which was walking around the mizbaich?

See בית יוסף & ב”ח סעיף ג 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

Learn the “גמרא דף מד: “אמר אייבו until next “אמר אייבו

See מהרש”א on the גירסא of the Gemara 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=505

Learn תוספת “ואינה

Learn תוספת “שלשה

Question:

Is Tosfos giving a different explanation than Rashi? See מהרש”א and מהר”ם

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=505

Questions:

What is the point of argument between רב נחמן and רב ששת in regards to how many Aravos one needs to take?

Learn ר”ן 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=626

Question:

What needs to be done with the aravos in order to fulfill the mitzvah of Hoshanas?

See רש”י דף מג: “והביאום (three lines from bottom of the Amud) 

And רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כב

In conclusion of the Gemara is the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah זכר למקדש or מנהג נביאים? 

What do we conclude lhalacha in regards to making a bracha on taking the Aravos? 

Learn טור אורח חיים ס’ תרס”ד סעיף ב for a few different opinions

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

And שולחן ערוך סע’ ב, ד-ו with the משנה ברורה for final conclusion

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=271

Major Question:

The גמרא דף מג concluded that Aravah was בנטילה – everyone waved the Aravos each day of Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash and the זכר למקדש replicates the way it was performed in the Beis Hamikdash & on דף מד the aravos were taken when encircling the Mizbeach.

Why is our minhag to walk around the bima each day of Sukkos one time only with the set of Daled Minim and on Hoshana Rabbah seven times.  We should be holding aravos when circling the bima as they did in the Beis Hamikdash when circling the Mizbeach? 

But this seems incongruent with how  the Beis Hamikdash as on the practice  Especially since we conclude that Hoshanos we’re instituted זכר למקדש for the נטילה which was walking around the mizbeach?

See בית יוסף & ב”ח סעיף ג 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

The Gemara concluded with the answer כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין 

Major Question:

The Gemara on מד says that the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah is זכר למקדש. 

But the gemara now says it was a either a יסוד and מנהג נביאים?

See רבינו חננאל (on side of the Gemara) for a different explanation than Rashi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כא-כב and מגיד משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Major Question:

The Rambam says the mitzvah of Aravah we take on Hoshana Rabbah is both זכר למקדש and מנהג נביאים. 

How could it be both? 

What compelled the Rambam to give this explanation?

The Rambam seems to offer an entirely new reason than the גמרא מד as to why the mitzvah of Aravah is only one day זכר למקדש?

Learn ערוך לנר for an explanation for the Rambam

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

Can we offer a different explanation for the Rambam based on the conclusion of the Gemara of כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין?

According to אבא שאול the mitzvah of Aravah in the Beis Hamikdash is learnt from the words ערבי נחל

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת who asks where in the pasuk is it indicated that it’s limited to Beis Hamikdash?

See תוספת ראש

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14724&st=&pgnum=60

And ערוך לנר

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=125

Learn “גמרא דף מד: “א”ר אמי ערבה צריכה שיעור (top line) until “אמר אייבו”  

See מהרש”א on the גירסא of the Gemara 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=505

Learn תוספת “ואינה

Learn תוספת “שלשה

Question:

Is Tosfos giving a different explanation than Rashi? See מהרש”א and מהר”ם

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=505

Questions:

What is the point of argument between רב נחמן and רב ששת in regards to how many Aravos one needs to take?

Learn ר”ן 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=626

How do we conclude lhalacha in regards to how many Aravos one needs to take, amount of leaves, size?

Learn רא”ש end of סימן א

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=482

Learn טור אורח חיים ס’ תרס”ד סעיף ד (just the second half) & סעיף ה & ו 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=595

Learn שולחן ערוך with the משנה ברורה 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60391&st=&pgnum=271

Very quickly review גמרא דף מד. “איתמר ר’ יוחנן וריב”ל (eleven lines from bottom of the Amud) 

Learn גמרא תמורה דף טז. “גופא אמר רב יהודה (three lines from top of the Amud until the wide lines)

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=34&daf=16&format=pdf

Question:

How could ר’ אבהו answer the contradiction of whether Aravah is a יסוד נביאים or הלכה למשה מסיני when the Gemara Temura clearly says one can not ask through prophecy to be taught forgotten halachos?

See ערוך לנר סוכה דף מד. “וחזרו

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

Learn חידושי גרי”ז על יומא page 26-27 who says a novel difference between a הלכה למשה מסיני and one that was forgotten and restored by עתניאל בן קנז or other Chachamim 

Learn חידושי גרי”ז תמורה טז אות ב who explains a difference between תורה לאו בשמים and אין הנביא רשאי לחדש דבר

Note: The difference between יסוד and מנהג נביאים that Rashi gives. 

The Gemara concludes כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין 

See how Rashi explains this answer

According to Rashi the נביאים set up the taking of Aravos outside the Beis Hamikdash. 

Was this for all seven days of Sukkos or just the last day – Hoshana Rabbah? 

Major Question:

The Gemara on מד says that the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah is זכר למקדש. 

But the gemara now says it was a either a יסוד and מנהג נביאים?

See רבינו חננאל (on side of the Gemara) for a different explanation than Rashi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כא-כב and מגיד משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Major Question:

The Rambam says the mitzvah of Aravah we take on Hoshana Rabbah is both זכר למקדש and מנהג נביאים. 

How could it be both? 

What compelled the Rambam to give this explanation?

The Rambam seems to offer an entirely new reason than the גמרא מד as to why the mitzvah of Aravah is only one day זכר למקדש?

Learn ערוך לנר for an explanation for the Rambam

Can we offer a different explanation for the Rambam based on the conclusion of the Gemara of כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין?

According to אבא שאול the mitzvah of Aravah in the Beis Hamikdash is learnt from the words ערבי נחל

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת who asks where in the pasuk is it indicated that it’s limited to Beis Hamikdash?

See תוספת ראש

And ערוך לנר

Quickly review “גמרא דף מד. “איתמר ר’ יוחנן וריב”ל (eleven lines from bottom of the Amud) 

Learn “גמרא תמורה דף טז. “גופא אמר רב יהודה (three lines from top of the Amud until the wide lines)

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=34&daf=16&format=pdf

Question:

How could ר’ אבהו answer the contradiction of whether Aravah is a יסוד נביאים or הלכה למשה מסיני when the Gemara Temura clearly says one can not ask through prophecy to be taught forgotten halachos?

See ערוך לנר סוכה דף מד. “וחזרו

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

Learn חידושי גרי”ז על יומא page 26-27 who says a novel difference between a הלכה למשה מסיני and one that was forgotten and restored by עתניאל בן קנז or other Chachamim 

Learn חידושי גרי”ז תמורה טז אות ב who explains a difference between תורה לאו בשמים and אין הנביא רשאי לחדש דבר

Note: The difference between יסוד and מנהג נביאים that Rashi gives. 

The Gemara concludes כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין 

See how Rashi explains this answer

According to Rashi the נביאים set up the taking of Aravos outside the Beis Hamikdash. 

Was this for all seven days of Sukkos or just the last day – Hoshana Rabbah? 

Major Question:

The Gemara on מד says that the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah is זכר למקדש. 

But the gemara now says it was a either a יסוד and מנהג נביאים?

See רבינו חננאל (on side of the Gemara) for a different explanation than Rashi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כא-כב and מגיד משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Major Question:

The Rambam says the mitzvah of Aravah we take on Hoshana Rabbah is both זכר למקדש and מנהג נביאים. 

How could it be both? 

What compelled the Rambam to give this explanation?

The Rambam seems to offer an entirely new reason than the גמרא מד as to why the mitzvah of Aravah is only one day זכר למקדש?

Learn ערוך לנר for an explanation for the Rambam

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

Can we offer a different explanation for the Rambam based on the conclusion of the Gemara of כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין?

According to אבא שאול the mitzvah of Aravah in the Beis Hamikdash is learnt from the words ערבי נחל

Learn “תוספות דף לד. “ואחת who asks where in the pasuk is it indicated that it’s limited to Beis Hamikdash?

See תוספות ראש

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14724&st=&pgnum=60

And ערוך לנר

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=125

Learn the Gemara “דף מד.”אלא אמר רב זביד (middle of the Amud) until “אתמר ר’ יוחנן ור’ יהושע בן לוי” eleven lines from bottom of the Amud)

Continue learning the Gemara “דף מד. “אתמר ר’ יוחנן ור’ יהושע בן לוי ( until top of דף מד: “א”ר אמי

Note: The difference between יסוד and מנהג נביאים that Rashi gives. 

The Gemara concludes כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין 

See how Rashi explains this answer

According to Rashi the נביאים set up the taking of Aravos outside the Beis Hamikdash. 

Was this for all seven days of Sukkos or just the last day – Hoshana Rabbah? 

Major Question:

The Gemara on מד says that the taking of Aravos on Hoshana Rabbah is זכר למקדש. 

But the gemara now says it was a either a יסוד and מנהג נביאים?

See רבינו חננאל (on side of the Gemara) for a different explanation than Rashi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כא-כב and מגיד משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Major Question:

The Rambam says the mitzvah of Aravah we take on Hoshana Rabbah is both זכר למקדש and מנהג נביאים. 

How could it be both? 

What compelled the Rambam to give this explanation?

The Rambam seems to offer an entirely new reason than the גמרא מד as to why the mitzvah of Aravah is only one day זכר למקדש?

Learn ערוך לנר for an explanation for the Rambam

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

Can we offer a different explanation for the Rambam based on the conclusion of the Gemara of כאן במקדש כאן בגבולין?

According to אבא שאול the mitzvah of Aravah in the Beis Hamikdash is learnt from the words ערבי נחל

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת who asks where in the pasuk is it indicated that it’s limited to Beis Hamikdash?

See תוספת ראש

And ערוך לנר

Learn the Gemara “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud) until אלא אמר רב זביד

The Gemara presents three answers as to why Aravos (Hoshanos) are only taken one day זכר למקדש even though in the Beis Hamikdash aravos were taken all seven days of Sukkos.

Questions:

In the first proposed answer does Rava believe that indeed there is a Mitzvah to take aravos all seven days of Sukkos זכר למקדש?

In the final answer of the Gemara why does the fact that there is no Mitzvah from the Torah to take aravos outside of the Beis Hamikdash affect the decision of instituting a mitzvah of Aravah all seven days זכר למקדש as was done in the Beis Hamikdash?

See ריטב”א “מאי שנא  https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.44a.1?lang=bi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה כא-כב and מגיד משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Major Question:

The Rambam seems to offer an entirely new reason than the Gemara as to why mitzvah the of Aravah is only one day זכר למקדש?

Learn ערוך לנר for an explanation for the Rambam

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=171

According to אבא שאול the mitzvah of Aravah in the Beis Hamikdash is learnt from the words ערבי נחל

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת who asks where in the pasuk is it indicated that it’s limited to Beis Hamikdash?

See תוספת ראש 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14724&st=&pgnum=60

And ערוך לנר

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14414&st=&pgnum=125

Very quickly review  “גמרא מג: “ואלא לידחו (three lines from bottom of the Amud) until “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud)

Questions:

Why does there need to be a uniform practice both in chutz laaretz and Eretz Yisrael?

Learn “רש”י דף מד. “לדידהו who explains because the prohibition of לא תתגודדו – having groups performing mitzvos differently as it gives the appearance of two religions.  

The גמרא יבמות דף יג:-יד states that לא תתגודדו is only an issue according to אביי when there are different practices in one city and according to רבא even in one city it is acceptable if there are two different ruling courts (שתי בתי דין) which explains how on Purim there are different days for reading the Megillah (see תוספת שם “כי & רא”ש ס’ ט) 

So how could Rashi say there is an issue of לא תתגודדו to have chutz laaretz have different practice than Eretz Yisrael when they are two different regions?  

Major Questions:

According to the Gemara, only after the destruction of the Beis Hamikdash did they institute a universal rule regarding taking Hoshanos on Hashanah Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos. 

During the time of the Beis Hamikdash why was this not an issue of לא תתגודדו?

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

Why isn’t the keeping of a second day of Yom tov in chutz laaretz an issue of לא תתגודדו?

Learn רמב”ם ה’ לולב פרק ז הלכה ז and the לחם משנה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

See מאירי דף מג. ” ושאל בה איננו דיי בקיבועא דירחא 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=57966&st=&pgnum=116

And ערוך לנר יבמות דף יד 

Continue learning the Gemara “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud) until אלא אמר רב זביד

Question:

What’s the final answer of the Gemara as to why Aravos (Hoshanos) are only taken one day זכר למקדש even though in the Beis Hamikdash aravos were taken all seven days of Sukkos? 

See ריטב”א “מאי שנא https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.44a.1?lang=bi

Learn רמב״ם הלכות לולב פרק ז הלכה י”ז-י”ח https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=287

Learn “תוספת מג: “והביאו

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת

Learn the “גמרא מג: “איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) until “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud)

Questions:

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

Rashi “מד. “לדידהו says this is an issue of לא תתגודדו but the Gemara Yevomas clearly states that לא תתגודדו is only an issue when there are different practices in one city? 

Learn “תוספת מג: “והביאו

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת

Questions:

Why does there need to be a uniform practice both in chutz laaretz and Eretz Yisrael?

Learn “רש”י דף מד. “לדידהו who explains because the prohibition of לא תתגודדו – having groups performing mitzvos differently as it gives the appearance of two religions.  

The גמרא יבמות דף יג:-יד states that לא תתגודדו is only an issue according to אביי when there are different practices in one city and according to רבא even in one city it is acceptable if there are two different ruling courts (שתי בתי דין) which explains how on Purim there are different days for reading the Megillah (see תוספת שם “כי & רא”ש ס’ ט) 

So how could Rashi say there is an issue of לא תתגודדו to have chutz laaretz have different practice than Eretz Yisrael when they are two different regions?  

According to the Gemara, only after the destruction of the Beis Hamikdash did they institute a universal rule regarding taking Hoshanos on Hashanah Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos. 

During the time of the Beis Hamikdash why was this not an issue of לא תתגודדו?

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

See מאירי דף מג. ” ושאל בה איננו דיי בקיבועא דירחא 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=57966&st=&pgnum=116

Why isn’t the keeping of a second day of Yom tov in chutz laaretz an issue of לא תתגודדו?

Very quickly review גמרא דף מג: “אי הכי  (thirteen lines from top of the Amud) until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Questions:

According to the opinion that taking Aravah post churban is just a minhag and not even a mitzvah from the Rabanan why would one have permission to handle the Aravos on Shabbos as they are muktzah?

See ריטב”א “ופרכינן אי הכי for an answer.

The Gemara answers “Because we are not experts to calculate the precise day of Yom Tov that’s why we can’t take aravos on Hoshana Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos.”

What’s the major concern even if hoshana Rabbah is really the sixth day of Sukkos there is no issue with taking the Aravah as the Gemara said in essence one should be permitted to take Aravah every day of Sukkos to publicize that it’s a mitzvah from the Torah just we don’t to prevent people from treating the mitzvah of Lulav lightly? 

Learn “תוספת מג: “לא איקלע

Learn the “גמרא מג: “איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) until “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud)

Questions:

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

Rashi “מד. “לדידהו says this is an issue of לא תתגודדו but the Gemara Yevomas clearly states that לא תתגודדו is only an issue when there are different practices in one city? 

Learn “תוספת מג: “והביאו

Learn תוספת דף לד. “ואחת

Questions:

Why does there need to be a uniform practice both in chutz laaretz and Eretz Yisrael?

Learn “רש”י דף מד. “לדידהו who explains because the prohibition of לא תתגודדו – having groups performing mitzvos differently as it gives the appearance of two religions.  

The גמרא יבמות דף יג:-יד states that לא תתגודדו is only an issue according to אביי when there are different practices in one city and according to רבא even in one city it is acceptable if there are two different ruling courts (שתי בתי דין) which explains how on Purim there are different days for reading the Megilah (see תוספת שם “כי & רא”ש ס’ ט) 

So how could Rashi say there is an issue of לא תתגודדו to have chutz laaretz have different practice than Eretz Yisrael when they are two different regions?  

According to the Gemara only after the destruction of the Beis Hamikdash did they institute a universal rule regarding taking Hoshanos on Hashanah Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos. 

During the time of the Beis Hamikdash why was this not an issue of לא תתגודדו?

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

See מאירי דף מג. ” ושאל בה איננו דיי בקיבועא דירחא 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=57966&st=&pgnum=116

Why isn’t the keeping of a second day of Yom tov in chutz laaretz an issue of לא תתגודדו?

Very quickly review גמרא דף מג: “אי הכי  (thirteen lines from top of the Amud) until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Review תוס “שלוחי

Learn the ריטב”א and see how he gives a different explanation than Tosfos as to why the Gemara assumes that post Churban Beis Hamikdash there should be no concern of גזירה דרבה when taking the Aravah on Hoshana Rabbah when it coincides Shabbos.

Note the difference in explanation between Rashi and the ריטב”א “אי הכי כל  regarding “אתי לפקפוקי בלולב” 

Questions:

According to the opinion that taking Aravah post churban is just a minhag and not even a mitzvah from the Rabanan why would one have permission to handle the Aravos on Shabbos as they are muktzah?

See ריטב”א “ופרכינן אי הכי for an answer.

The Gemara answers “Because we are not experts to calculate the precise day of Yom Tov that’s why we can’t take aravos on Hoshana Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos.”

What’s the major concern even if hoshana Rabbah is really the sixth day of Sukkos there is no issue with taking the Aravah as the Gemara said in essence one should be permitted to take Aravah every day of Sukkos to publicize that it’s a mitzvah from the Torah just we don’t to prevent people from treating the mitzvah of Lulav lightly? 

Learn תוספת “לא איקלע

Learn the “גמרא מג: “איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) until “דף מד. “א”ל אביי (seven lines from the top of the Amud)

Learn תוספת מג: “והביאו

Questions:

What changed after the destruction of the beis hamikdash that created an issue of people in chutz laaretz doing things differently than the Jews in Eretz Yisrael?

Rashi says this is an issue of לא תתגודדו but the Gemara Yevomas clearly states that it is only an issue when there are different practices in one city? 

Very quickly review גמרא דף מג: “ערבה שבעה כיצד (two dots) until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Write or chart each question and answer of the Gemara.

Learn ריטב”א on the entire Gemara who addresses many of the questions below 

https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.43b.1?lang=bi

The Gemara says Aravah is permitted to be taken on Shabbos when it coincides with Hoshana Rabbah because שלוחי בית דין מייתי לה 

List 

1. The argument between the ריטב”א “ומהדרינן and מהרש”א whether this a retraction from the first reason of לפרסום שהיא מן התורה

2. The argument between תוספת מג: “שלוחי and the ריטב”א as to why the Gemara assumes that post Churban Beis Hamikdash there should be no concern of גזירה דרבה when taking the Aravah on Hoshana Rabbah when it coincides Shabbos.

3. The explanation from Rashi and an alternate explanation from the ריטב”א “אי הכי כל  of “אתי לפקפוקי בלולב” 

Questions:

According to the opinion that taking Aravah post churban is just a minhag and not even a mitzvah from the Rabanan why would one have permission to handle the Aravos on Shabbos as they are muktzah?

See ריטב”א “ופרכינן אי הכי for an answer.

The Gemara answers “Because we are not experts to calculate the precise day of Yom Tov that’s why we can’t take aravos on Hoshana Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos.”

What’s the major concern even if hoshana Rabbah is really the sixth day of Sukkos there is no issue with taking the Aravah as the Gemara said in essence one should be permitted to take Aravah every day of Sukkos to publicize that it’s a mitzvah from the Torah just we don’t to prevent people from treating the mitzvah of Lulav lightly? 

Learn תוספת “לא איקלע

Learn גמרא דף מג: “ערבה שבעה כיצד (two dots) until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Questions:

Why doesn’t the Gemara open with a similar question that it asked on Lulav on דף מב asking why Aravah is not taken on the first six days of Sukkos when it coincides with Shabbos? 

The Gemara says Aravah is permitted to be taken on Shabbos when it coincides with Hoshana Rabbah because שלוחי בית דין מייתי לה 

Is this a retraction from the first reason of לפרסום שהיא מן התורה?

Learn ריטב”א “ומהדרינן 

See מהרש”א 

How does the fact that שלוחי בית דין מייתי לה agents of the court bring the aravos avoid the concern of someone carrying an Aravah on Shabbos? 

The Gemara ask “Why don’t we post Churban Beis Hamikdash take the Aravah on hoshana Rabbah when it coincides Shabbos” 

What is the logic to permit this as our practice is that everyone takes the Aravah not just שלוחי בית דין and therefore the גזירה דרבה is applicable and we should be concerned someone might carry the Aravah?  

Learn תוספת מג: “שלוחי

Learn ריטב”א who gives a different explanation than Rashi and Tosfos

Question on Rashi:

Rashi explains the opening question of the gemara is based on גזירה דרבה. How could the gemara than offer the explanation of גזירה דרבה when explaining why Lulav is not taken on Shabbos as this is already known? 

The Gemara says Aravah is taken only one specific day of Sukkos that coincides with Shabbos as if it would be taken any of the seven days of Sukkos that coincides with Shabbos “אתי לפקפוקי בלולב” 

See Rashi for one explanation

See ריטב”א “אי הכי כל who gives different explanation

According to the opinion that taking Aravah post churban is just a minhag and not even a mitzvah from the Rabanan why would we have permission to take them on Shabbos as the Aravos are muktzah?

See ריטב”א “ופרכינן אי הכי for an answer.

The Gemara answers “Because we are not experts to calculate the precise day of Yom Tov that’s why we can’t take aravos on Hoshana Rabbah that coincides with Shabbos.”

What’s the major concern even if hoshana Rabbah is really the sixth day of Sukkos there is no issue with taking the Aravah as the Gemara said in essence one should be permitted to take Aravah every day of Sukkos to publicize that it’s a mitzvah from the Torah just we don’t to prevent people from treating the mitzvah of Lulav lightly? 

Link to ריטב”א on the entire Gemara who addresses many of these questions

https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.43b.1?lang=bi

Continue learning the Gemara until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Very quickly review the דף מג. “דאיתיה בגבולין (fifteen lines from top of the Amud) until “וסוכה גופא מנלן” (thirteen lines from bottom of the Amud)

Question: Are the disqualifications of the Daled Minim in the Beis Hamikdash all seven days the same as those of the first day of Sukkos?

There is an argument between Tosfos and the Ramban whether the requirement of לכם – to own the Daled Minim – applies for the Daled Minim for the entire Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash 

See תוספת דף כט: “בעינן

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=7&daf=29b&format=pdf

See ריטב”א beginning of the third Perek

https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.29b?lang=bi

See ביכורי יעקב ס’ תרנ”ח ס”ק א for a lengthy discussion how one can fulfill mitzvah from the Torah of Daled Minim all seven days of Sukkos

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=49325&st=&pgnum=68

Question:

Is there any current practical application of the halacha requirements of Daled Minim in the Beis Hamikdash all seven days of Sukkos even though we don’t have a Beis Hamikdash?

See Mishna .דף מא 

Rashi on the Mishna 

And פירוש משניות לרמב”ם on the Mishna who argue what area is considered מקדש

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=487

And רמב״ם הלכות שופר פרק ב הלכה ח  https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14278&st=&pgnum=262&hilite=

And רמב״ם הלכות בית הבחירה פרק ו הלכה יד-טו וראב”ד שם

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=58963&st=&pgnum=16

See ביכורי יעקב ס’ תרנ”ח ס”ק א for a lengthy discussion how one can fulfill mitzvah from the Torah of Daled Minim all seven days of Sukkos

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=49325&st=&pgnum=68

Please spend time this morning to write a summary of the above Sugya.

Learn גמרא דף מג. “וסוכה גופא מנלן (thirteen lines from bottom of Amud) until the two dots on דף מג עמוד ב 

Continue learning the Gemara until איתיביה אביי (middle of the Amud) 

Topic: The mitzvah of Daled Minim in Beis Hamikdash and the rest of the world.

Learn the דף מג. “דאיתיה בגבולין (fifteen lines from top of the Amud) until “וסוכה גופא מנלן” (thirteen lines from bottom of the Amud)

Question on “רש”י “אלא ראשון:

Why should the fact that the Mitzvah of Daled Minim on the second – seventh day of Sukkos is only in the Beis Hamikdash be a reason that the Rabanan should allow a gezeira to not perform the Mitzvah?

Learn תוספת “הא

Chakirah: Is the mitzvah of Daled Minim all seven days of Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash – an extension of the Mitzvah of Daled Minim of the first day obligation everywhere or an independent mitzvah? Think of a נפקא מינה between the two options 

Learn בעל המאור “אי הכי (first one on fourth Perek)

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=624

Note: how the בעל המאור explains different than תוספת “הא and avoids the major question we asked on Tosfos 

How could Tosfos suggest limiting the Daled Minim for the seven days of Sukkos which coincide with Shabbos to one’s home?  The only mitzvah for the rest of Sukkos is in the Beis Hamikdash?  

Learn עמק ברכה ה’ לולב אות א “וסוכה מג for an answer

Bring a proof to the chakirah 

1. from the Gemara 

2. from “רש”י “אלא ראשון 

See מנחת חינוך מצוה שכד ס”ק א

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14092&st=&pgnum=164

See עמק ברכה ה’ לולב אות א 

Question: Are the disqualifications of the Daled Minim in the Beis Hamikdash all seven days the same as those of the first day of Sukkos?

There is an argument between Tosfos and the Ramban whether the requirement of לכם – to own the Daled Minim – applies for the Daled Minim for the entire Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash 

See תוספת דף כט: “בעינן

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=7&daf=29b&format=pdf

See ריטב”א beginning of the third Perek

https://www.sefaria.org/Ritva_on_Sukkah.29b?lang=bi

See ביכורי יעקב ס’ תרנ”ח ס”ק א for a lengthy discussion how one can fulfill mitzvah from the Torah of Daled Minim all seven days of Sukkos

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=49325&st=&pgnum=68

Very quickly review the “גמרא דף מב: “אמר רבה” until דף מג. “דאיתיה בגבולין (fifteen lines from top of the Amud) 

Topic: גזירה דרבה שלא ליטול לולב בשבת

Quickly review “תוספת “אינהו who asks 

Why is there a difference in the gezeira between Lulav and Shofar?

What’s the explanation for the incongruity of the gezeira on the Mitzvah of shofar during the time of Beis Hamikdash to the gezeira after the churban?

In Conclusion:

Why is the Mitzvah of Daled Minim not performed on the first day of Sukkos which coincides with Shabbos? 

Is it because gezeira to prevent one from carrying on Shabbos, or because of the uncertainty whether the first day of Sukkos is the fifteenth or fourteenth of Tishrei? 

See ריף מגילה דף ד: “גרסינן במסכת סוכה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14306&st=&pgnum=609

Learn ר”ן on our Gemara

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=624

Bring a proof from the ר”ן if he agrees with the רי”ף 

Learn the דף מג. “דאיתיה בגבולין (fifteen lines from top of the Amud) until “וסוכה גופא מנלן” (thirteen lines from bottom of the Amud)

Topic: The mitzvah of Daled Minim in Beis Hamikdash and the rest of the world.

Question:

Is the mitzvah of Daled Minim all seven days of Sukkos in the Beis Hamikdash an extension of the Mitzvah of Daled Minim of the first day obligation everywhere?

or an independent mitzvah?

Practical difference – נפקא מינה – if one performed the mitzvah of Daled Minim on the first day of Sukkos in his home and later that day went to the Beis Hamikdash would he have to take the Daled Minim again 

Learn בעל המאור “אי הכי (first one on fourth Perek)

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=624

Note: how the בעל המאור explains different than תוספת “הא and avoids the major question we asked on Tosfos 

How could Tosfos suggest limiting the Daled Minim for the seven days of Sukkos which coincide with Shabbos to one’s home?  The only mitzvah for the rest of Sukkos is in the Beis Hamikdash?  See עמק ברכה ה’ לולב אות א “וסוכה מג for an answer

Bring a proof to the chakirah 

1. from the Gemara we learnt today

2. from “רש”י “אלא ראשון (on gemara earlier on the Amud)

See מנחת חינוך מצוה שכד ס”ק א

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14092&st=&pgnum=164

See עמק ברכה ה’ לולב אות א 

Very quickly review the “גמרא דף מב: “אמר רבה” until דף מג. “דאיתיה בגבולין (fifteen lines from top of the Amud) 

Topic: גזירה דרבה שלא ליטול לולב בשבת

Quickly review “תוספת “אינהו who asks 

Why is there a difference in the gezeira between Lulav and Shofar?

What’s the explanation for the incongruity of the gezeira on the Mitzvah of shofar during the time of Beis Hamikdash to the gezeira after the churban?

Question:

Why didn’t the Rabanan make a gezeira not to perform a Bris Milah on Shabbos to prevent someone from carrying the milah knife to consult with an expert? 

Why didn’t the Rabanan make a gezeira not to blow shofar at the end of Yom Kippur?

Learn תוספת מגילה דף ד: “ויעבירנו (second Tosfos)

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=11&daf=4b&format=pdf

Learn “תוספת “הא

Question on Tosfos:

Tosfos asks that the mitzvah of Daled Minim should be allowed inside ones home whichever day of Sukkos coincides with Shabbos. The gemara is discussing the time period of the beis hamikdash which only had a Mitzvah in the Beis Hamikdash. How could Tosfos suugest to perform the mitzvah of Daled Minim in one’s home on any of the seven days?

Learn משנה ראש השנה פרק ג, משנה א   

https://hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=9&daf=29b&format=pdf

Note: Which locations and time periods was blowing shofar on Shabbos Rosh Hashanah permitted. 

Learn “תוספת “אינהו who asks 

Why is there a difference in the gezeira between Lulav and Shofar?

What’s the explanation for the incongruity of the gezeira on the Mitzvah of shofar during the time of Beis Hamikdash to the gezeira after the churban?

In Conclusion:

Why is the Mitzvah of Daled Minim not performed on the first day of Sukkos which coincides with Shabbos? 

Is it because gezeira to prevent one from carrying on Shabbos, or because of the uncertainty whether the first day of Sukkos is the fifteenth or fourteenth of Tishrei? 

See ריף מגילה דף ד: “גרסינן במסכת סוכה

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14306&st=&pgnum=609

Learn ר”ן on our Gemara

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14319&st=&pgnum=624

Bring a proof from the ר”ן if he agrees with the רי”ף