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Conclusion of Sugya קורה באלכסון

Quickly review the גמרא דף ח: “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” until “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה

Review תוס’ “מניח

Questions:

Tosfos gives two answers. 

What’s the difference between the two answers?

Learn ריטב”א – note how he answers Tosfos question. 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=37287&st=&pgnum=13

What is the difference between Tosfos and the Ritva answers?

Rava holds the Korah must be placed straight and not on an angle because a Korah is just considered a היכר and placing a Korah on an angle is not a היכר.

Major Question: 

Tosfos תוס’ “מניח asked according to Rav Kahana how could it be permitted to carry along the border of the Korah even opposite the long wall as there are only two walls blocking in this part of the Mavui and need minimum of three walls to make it a reshus hayachid. Tosfos first answer is according to Rav Kahana Korah is Mechitza and therefore there really are three walls. 

Rava explains his position that one must place the Korah on straight from the edge of the short wall and parallel to the opposite wall to the edge of the long wall because  קורה משום היכר and if place the Korah on an angle its not a היכר 

Why doesn’t Rava just simply say the reason is קורה משום היכר and therefore if place the Korah on an angle from the short side to the long side you will only have two walls? 

According to Rava if one places the Korah on an angle from the edge of the short wall to the edge of the long wall would it be permitted to carry in the back part of the Mavui from the inside of the short wall? 

See ביאור הלכה ס’ שס”ג סע’ ל “אינו מניח who brings a dispute between the Machatzits Hashekel and Pri Megadim regarding this.

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60389&st=&pgnum=66

See מחצית השקל ס’ שס”ג ס”ק ל for his Chidush and the פרי מגדים משבצות זהב ס”ק כא who argues and based on his position answers the major question we asked above. 

Major Question:

How could the Machatzitz Hashekel permit carrying in the back part of the Mavui Tosfos clearly says if one can not carry opposite the long wall than its considered outside the mavui and the korah is considered placed outside the mavui therefore the Korah should not be able to allow one to carry inside any part of the mavui? 

Learn the גמרא דף ח:  “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה until “איתיביה (bottom of the Amud)

Question:

Why is it definitely prohibited to carry in the area opposite the Lechi?

Learn תוס’ “הכל (first half of Tosfos until “דהא אביי )

The Rishonim give other explanations.

Learn רשב”א דף ח: “אמר רב חסדא

Learn תוס’ ריד דף ט for a chidush in how Lechi operates as a Mechitza 

Learn קרן אורה דף ט. “תני ר’ זכאי who adds an understanding in the operation of Lechi as a Mechitza 

Quickly review the גמרא דף ח: “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” until “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה

Review תוס’ “מניח

Questions:

Tosfos gives two answers. 

What’s the difference between the two answers?

Learn ריטב”א – note how he answers Tosfos question. 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=37287&st=&pgnum=13

What is the difference between Tosfos and the Ritva answers?

Rava argues and holds the Korah must be placed straight and not on an angle. The gemara says the reason is because a Korah on an angle is not a היכר.

Why doesn’t the gemara simply say the reason is קורה משום היכר and therefore if place the Korah on an angle from the short side to the long side you will only have two walls? 

See ביאור הלכה ס’ שס”ג סע’ ל “אינו מניח

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60389&st=&pgnum=66

See מחצית השקל ס’ שס”ג ס”ק ל and פרי מגדים משבצות זהב ס”ק כא

Can one place a Korah on an angle if it’s placed in middle of the mavui? 

See רא”ש ס’ י (first half)

And קרבן נתנאל אות ע

And שולחן ארוך או”ח ס’ שס”ג, ל

Continue learning the גמרא דף ח:  “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה until “איתיביה (bottom of the Amud)

Learn the גמרא דף ח: “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” until “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה

Learn תוס’ “מניח

Questions:

Why does Rashi and Tosfos both explain according to רב כהנא it is permitted to carry opposite the long wall?

In the question of Tosfos why does tosfos understand it’s considered as there are only two walls ?

Tosfos gives two answers. 

What’s the difference between the two answers?

Learn ריטב”א – note how he answers Tosfos question. 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=37287&st=&pgnum=13

What is the difference between Tosfos and the Ritva answers?

Rava argues and holds the Korah must be placed straight and not on an angle. The gemara says the reason is because a Korah on an angle is not a היכר.

Why doesn’t the gemara simply say the reason is קורה משום היכר and therefore if place the Korah on an angle from the short side to the long side you will only have two walls? 

See ביאור הלכה ס’ שס”ג סע’ ל “אינו מניח

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60389&st=&pgnum=66

Quickly review the גמרא דף ח: “איתמר מבוי העשוי כנדל until “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” 

Learn תוס’ “מבוי

Question: 

Why does Tosfos say the side Mavui’s are not parallel one to another?

See  בית יוסף ס’ שס”ד סע ה “ומ”ש אפילו אין פתחי … and ב”ח

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=143

How do we conclude l’halacha?

See טור ס’ שס”ד סע ה and שולחן ערוך with the משנה ברורה 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60389&st=&pgnum=71&hilite=

Learn תוס’ “והא

Learn the גמרא דף ח: “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” until “איבעיא להו מהו להשתמש תחת הקורה

Learn תוס’ “מניח

See ריטב”א and note how he answers Tosfos question. 

What is the difference between Tosfos and the Ritva?

Learn the גמרא דף ח: “איתמר מבוי העשוי כנדל until “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” 

Questions:

Is the center מבוי open to Reshus Harabim only on one side or on both sides? 

Bring proof from Rashi

Are the מבואות הקטנים on one side of the center Mavui or both sides?

See ריטב”א “מבוי העשוי כנדל

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=37287&st=&pgnum=12&hilite=

Learn תוס’ “מבוי 

Why does Tosfos say the side Mavui’s are not parallel one to another?

See  בית יוסף ס’ שס”ד סע ה “ומ”ש אפילו אין פתחי … and ב”ח

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14268&st=&pgnum=143

How do we conclude l’halacha?

See טור ס’ שס”ד סע ה and שולחן ערוך with the משנה ברורה 

https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=60389&st=&pgnum=71&hilite=

Learn תוס’ “והא

Very quickly review the גמרא דף ח. “גופא אמר רב ירמיה בר אבא (two dots) until דף ח: “איתמר  (five lines from top of the Amud)

Rashi דף ח: “ולרבה has the words “ואפילו בחצר” in parentheses.  

Point to Consider:

Does a חצר  מפולש  have the same halacha as a מבוי מפולש?

See the מהרש”ל & מהרש”א & מהרש”א מהדורא בתרא (underneath the מהרש”א) who discuss why the חצר should also be prohibited.

Last week we learnt the גמרא דף ח. “מרימר פסיק לה לסורא באוזלי. Rashi learnt מרימר placed the nets on the end of the street before the sea. However the מגיד משנה explained according to the Rambam who rules we are not concerned for שמא יעלה הים שרטון the case was that מרימר placed the nets on the other open side of the street. 

Question on the מגיד משנה:

Rabbi Jaffe asked me the following question on Shabbos.

What was the need to place nets – a full wall on the fourth side as since the sea wall is a valid wall than this road is a classic dead end mavui which only requires a Lechi or Korah on the fourth side?

For a novel explanation see בית מאיר ס’ שס”ג סע’ כט

Learn the גמרא דף ח: “איתמר מבוי העשוי כנדל until “אמר רב כהנא בר תחליפא” 

Learn תוס’ “מבוי 

Learn תוס’ “והא